I was sort of apathetic about this law at first, but the more I read the happier I am it was struck down. The gist of it was people had to show state-issued identification to vote. The ID would have cost $20 and been valid for five years. So, not only was there a financial barrier to vote, but there’s also this from the Washington Post (login):
[T]he state recently reorganized the Department of Motor Vehicles, paring down the number of offices. After the reorganization, there were no DMV offices in Atlanta, a city with a wide black majority. The closest station is at least nine miles away. Fewer than 60 of the state’s 159 counties have DMV offices.
Where were people in the other 99 counties supposed to get IDs? I probably wouldn’t have a problem with this law if there were ID offices in every county and the IDs were free, but I now believe it was at least as bad as the ACLU said it was. Why didn’t I read those statistics about DMV offices and fees a year ago? Did I just somehow miss them?
Yes Rusty, you missed them. Those statistics were out there. That has been an argument since the very day the bill was argued in the legislature. I remember when I first moved here you could go to Kroger and get a license renewal or state id. Now, you cannot get one almost anywhere. This was all part of Sonny’s plan to dismantle anything that Gov. Barnes had done. He basically creates crisis after crisis and then will come back next year and fix them all. Just watch. Next year we are sure to see all sorts of Perdue sponsored legislation and initiatives to increase school funding, shore up the HOPE scholarship, and yes, increase the number of DMV offices around the state. Actually, a pretty good plan. Goddamn, I hate that man.
That part kills me. Money laundering doesn’t make it not a poll tax.
Oh yes, I was wondering when this issue would make it to this blog. I am amazed that people make such an issue out of this. Look the people that can’t afford $20 for an ID every 5 years, probably don’t know enough about the canindates to make an educated vote anyway. The constitution does not say that everyone has a right to vote, and I am beginning to think that everyone shouldn’t have that right anyway.
But when you need illegals and dead people to pull your canindate over the top, I can understand why having to present an ID would be a huge issue.
Jeffrey,
I usually try to be respectful of other people’s views here and whatnot, but your rationale is a steaming crock of anti-democratic shit. Seriously. Get your head out of Cobb County’s ass. And voter fraud works both ways, home boy. Just ask the people in Ohio. Bush won one county by three times the actual population.
Here are some things the US Constitution does say:
Who does that leave out?
Sorry, Jeffrey Sherman, but you do not get to decide who gets to vote and who doesn’t. It makes no difference whether someone “know[s] enough about the canindates to make an educated vote” - they still get to vote. That’s the way it works.
Anyway, how would we go about ascertaining who does know enough to make an educated vote? How would you define an “educated vote”? Why do you assume that people who have a certain level of income automatically take any interest whatsoever in politics on anything but a purely superficial level? Not sure who you associate with, but I know a hell of a lot of middle class folks who don’t know shit about any of the candidates, issues, etc. beyond what the holy Fox News tells them (if even that much). Are they making “an educated vote”?
Your argumenet is ludicrous.
Thank you for the WaPo link. I’m glad to see this radical right power grab get some national ink.
The “reorganization” of the DMV and increase in the ID charge is the piece of this that makes Sonny and his posse look so greedy - bad enough to require an ID but to then make it virtually impossible for a non-driving working stiff to get is beyond the pale.
The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.
And the ID is not based on race, color or other previous condition of servitude. If is a valid US ID issued by a STATE of the union. And it doesn’t have to be even a “driver’s licsense” so you don’t even have to know how to operate a motor vehicle. So as this condition goes, it qualifies… NEXT!!
The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex.
It does not limit the vote to any one person and doesn’t desciminate on the grounds of sex, creed or religion. So it follows this guideline… NEXT!!!
The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any state by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax.
It is not a tax at all. Based on the fact that the only branches of government at the National or State level that can pass tax legislation are the house. Also, the $20 if you do your research covers materials, labor and cost. There is no profit made here. NEXT!!!
The right of citizens of the United States, who are 18 years of age or older, to vote, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any state on account of age.
Anyone age 18 or above can get this ID so this is met as well.
The reason for this ID is simple… It is to enforce the most important part of all those wonderful phrases you quoted there, The right of citizens of the United States to vote, and all respect to you Rusty and you know I do, but that is what this ID is for. And I am sure that the Republican party is not helped nearly as much in the elections as the Democratic party is by non-citizen involvement in the vote.
Look all of you are right it Sucks that we in this country are at a point where this happens, and elections are not carried out honestly. Both the last two elections you can say and rightfully so (notice here that I am stating that the last election as well) were colored by gross mishaps in the voting. So why not solve it. GET AN ID!! Why is this a problem… Hmmm… It ain’t for me, or anyone else that is a law abiding citizen of the United States.
Should they make them available at Kroger’s, sure, and maybe at libraries as well, but to say that requiring one is an infringement on “rights”, I am sorry but I am not the one that is afraid of the truth here. If what I am “spewing” is truly “anti-democratic” then I am truly sorry that the party that once gave people the ability to become citizens is now working to undermine the very “priviledges” that come with that citizenship.
I’m not going to bother to respond to most of your drivel, but the part I quoted above really befuddles me. What makes you so sure? What do you have to back this specious claim up other than a hard-on for Faux News?
I also find it amusing that you think getting an ID will suddenly solve all problems with voter fraud. Have you ever used a fake ID to get into a bar? (For the record, not that it has anything to do with anything, though I’m sure you’ll try to tie it in somehow… I haven’t. But I’ve seen about a million other people do it.)
Before I get too worked up about this, I’m keeping in mind that the law was struck down for the vile, unconstitutional piece of shit that it is.
1) Charging people for an ID that’s necessary to vote is a tax, whether you call it one or not. Your “materials, labor, and cost” technicality is a truly wretched crock of bullshit.
2) Re:
Showing an ID isn’t the problem. Obtaining the ID is the problem. Not everybody makes enough money to drive a car (the poor), and not everybody is physically capable of driving a car (disabled combat vets, the elderly, etc.). So, when there’s no way for those people to get access to an ID (and there’s not for those who live in 99 Georgia counties, not just downtown Atlanta), those people are being shut out of the electoral process by this law.
If the fee is taken away and ID offices are opened in every county, I’d be okay with the law.
As for your other specious claims (”Democrats benefit more from electoral fraud”), show some proof. For every instance of dead people voting for Democrats, I’ll show you a case where dead people voted for Republicans. They all play dirty ball when the opportunities present themselves, and you’re delusional and/or willfully ignorant if you think Republicans don’t.
Let’s just remind everyone that there is not one proven case of voter fraud related to identification in the past few years.
The other concern that we should all have is the ability of poll workers to properly evaluate identification. My sweetie recently renewed his drivers license thru the mail. The photo on his DL was taken in 2000, it is now good thru 2010. Imagine the possible physical changes one can go thru in ten years.
Are we confident that the poll workers in all 159 counties can properly determine ones identity from a photo taken before they went bald, gained or lost weight, etc. Hell, some of the poll workers at my precinct can barely instruct me on how to fill out the forms…
All I can think is that those who support this legislation are damned frightened of potential voters.
Wow, all I have to say is I am shocked. First of all, in the end of my post I stated and I think I was pretty clear that I thought the ID’s needed to be more readily available (last paragraph).
Secondly, my response was hardly drivel, half of it was exact quotes from prior posts, and the other half was a “factual”, and I know that hurts some of you, statements about how this law is not “unconstitutional”.
Lastly, Rusty, I have 100% disabled vets in my family as my father in law, and 2 uncles. I have personally been in a position where my wife and I were both unemployed and didn’t have a job, were down to one car that was so old it didn’t run, and was completely dependent on Rome, GA’s public transportation.
I don’t need to be preached to by any of you about how hard it is to get from one place to another. But you know what I and my wife figured out a way to do it. Sometimes it was friends, sometimes it was family, and others it was walking or riding a bike. I don’t care how “helpless” you are there are ways to get somewhere and make things work. I have seen quadrapalegics that live full lives. I have seen parapalegics that drive cars.
I think that the only “people” that don’t make themselves better, and don’t perservere through hard times are not worthy of my charity or my help. You are responsible for you, that is true, but if you have friends, family and people that care then you can pull through. And the only people that have none of those, might want to think why that is the case.
This might seem harsh, but you know what I just don’t care.
That’s fine for employment, but not for electoral law.
I wish you would just come out and say “we won the last election, and if we want to pass a law that says the niggers and spics shouldn’t get to vote, then we should be able to do so. That’s democracy!!1! Majority rules!!1!”
I would never think of saying that because I don’t believe that. In fact I believe that all “citizens” of the US should vote.
I am not the one that is assuming that a person is not capable of acquirring an ID because of race, creed, religion, sex or lack of any of those.
And seeing as how you are none of those I find it a little interesting that you take the point of view that they can’t. I wonder which stance is more insulting to a person.
Lastly, I draw you back to your own blog and the final two paragraphs of my second post which I will italicise here in case one is incapable of reading it otherwise.
Both the last two elections you can say and rightfully so (notice here that I am stating that the last election as well) were colored by gross mishaps in the voting. So why not solve it.
And
Should they make them available at Kroger’s, sure, and maybe at libraries as well
All of that from a Republican. Hmmm…
So it’s a tidy coincidence that City of Atlanta doesn’t have a single DMV office but does have a whole shit ton of poor, black, typically Democratic-voting residents? Uh-huh. I call bullshit.
As for your boldface/italicized commentary, yeah, you agreed with what I wrote in my original post. Problem is, it’s contrary to what you wrote earlier:
As for the rest of it…
If you had read my original post, you’d have noticed my problem NEVER WAS with showing an ID, but rather with the discriminatory way in which IDs are issued.
This is all rather pointless, since the piece of shit was struck down. And good riddance.
Yes once again, people have found a way to take an initiative that would have worked if just tweaked a little, and instead of making it work or discussing “how to make it work” instead just struck it down. That is good policy. Who cares about actually accomplishing something lets just make slight progress and then stike it down when it isn’t perfect because actaully taking the time to fix it would be way to much trouble right.
Holy CRAP!!! I sound like a true moderate.
Rusty’s already covered the ground, but I would like to point out that the forms of “ID” needed to get the fabled “VOTER ID CARD” are the same ones you could use to vote in the first place. If they’re good enough to issue a $20.00 piece of plastic, I see no reason why those same documents aren’t good enough to let you vote.
Lastly, “progress” does not mean, intentaionlly or not intentionally, disenfranchising poor or less mobile people. There are actually people in this world whose families are dead or scattered, whose friends are deceased, and who “don’t want to bother anybody.” In my line of work, I talk to a lot of these older people, and honestly, it’s not their “fault” that they’re alone in the world, and it’s not because they’re bad people necessarily — it’s just how things turned out. I’m not going to argue the intention of the law in this particular arena, but I will say that a law that disenfranchises even one person is a bad law, and this law would have resulted in the disenfranchisement of many people.
Jeffrey,
Not only did the Republicans running both houses of the Georgia Legislature refuse to entertain any of those suggestions with their bill, they also refused to bring an alternate bill offered by Democrats to a vote which would have offered many of the same benefits, but without the voter disenfranchisement in the Republican version. Hence, the vile piece of shit was passed and subsequently struck down. The end.
If they were even remotely interested in addressing real voter fraud, they’d tighten restrictions on absentee voting. But they’re not, so they didn’t.
And now for the other half of the story. It was 30 years of Democratic houses and Senates that has allowed the voting process to get to this point. Not to mention the fact that there was no movement at all in the wake of the Clinton presidency because he thought Gore would ride the crap right into the White House. Niether party is not to blame here.
Fact is, that the bill was probably more reactionary than it should have been. But the fact that it takes that reactionary a bill to get passed is a sad fact. I think that the Republicans truly are interested in addressing voting fraud. However, I believe that President Bush and Governor Perdue are not “conservative or right wing” enough to make the real changes necessary.
Mr Sherman,
I respectfully ask you to provide some evidence of this “voter fraud” you continue to mention. Links would be great; or counties where this fraud took place; anything that would get me on the path to finding some details. I am aware of no voter fraud that would be solved by the voter ID legislation.
Seriously Jeffrey, all I’ve heard is a lot of conjecture and not one shred of evidence. What is “this point” when you can’t demonstrate a single example of fraud?
I’ll give you a hint to start your research: Georgia isn’t a very good place to look since few elections were contentious here. There is little motivation to commit fraud here when you weigh the penalties against the potential outcome. Try Ohio. There was evidence of voter fraud from both Democrats and Republicans there. Try other swing states.
Also, would you please explain why it would take someone more “right wing” to solve voter fraud issues? It takes the right wing to create more government bureaucracy and more government-imposed obstacles to the voting process? Last I checked, isn’t the right wing about decreasing the size of government and increasing freedom from it, not increasing it? Sounds like a pretty insidious form of left wing politics (like Mao Zedong’s) to me.
You can polish this turd all you want to, but it’s still a turd.
I’m writing a paper on this for my political science class. You guys seem to be pretty knowledgeable about this. If this law were passed, who would benefit. I understand the people who vote honestly would be reassured that their vote wouldn’t be essentially made worthless by the guy that votes 20 times with fake names. Does anyone else benefit?